>200kg Bench Press = 20+ metres ?

  • @Bill Pendleton No electrodes, simple measurement. Go to my website Rutger Smith | Shot put & Discus throw | www.RutgerSmith.com - Photo 1 - scroll down a bit 26 -12 - 2008


    You can see the setup there. Easy and simple, the data you read from the little device


    @Thomas Johnson


    You just see what kind of speed and power you produce. Nothing fancy but its simple to see if you are progressing or if you are in a good shape.


    Besides that it gives you the optimal load. So the weight with which you can transfer the highest amount of Watts. For in a speed phase. For me is that with bench 120 kg

  • The whole thing of getting stronger in the weight room for a thrower is getting faster with the 'light' weights. I got stronger year by year when I was younger. And my power and speed went up too. But since I went from 180kg in bench to 200kg nothing changed. The power output didn't change a lot. My optimal load went up from 100kg to 120kg over the years.


    I just found my highest Watts back the other day in bench: 100kg - 1632W / 140kg - 1485W


    In bench you don't transfer any more weights as the bar and the plates. If you do squats you change it in the device, fill in your bodyweight and the device automatically takes into account. The power output is way higher.


    I tried to search for a website but I cannot find any company anymore who sells these devices. Google on nemesis micro muscle lab (power plus). Or muscle lab in general. I just had a quick look.

  • i think for throwers using glide tech they need that base strength of 190 200 kg bench press it is different for throwers who use rotation
    when i through 20 76 my bench was 230 kg however earlier when i was struggling to reach 20 meter my bench press was 250 to 260 kg so it all depends on how you use that bench press strength in your throwing

  • Rutger
    I googled those terms and looked on Amazon and ebay and no luck, just supplements etc. I will keep looking. I guess I could use a stop watch but I'm not sure how I would apply it since you could do the bar the fastest of all but you're not pushing anything. There must be a formula. Any suggestions from anyone?

  • @Wrucky for discus bench press might not be the most important exercise to do. what were your snatch, squat and clean weights you moved at that time?
    Sure speed and for Al technique is really important. But since most of the juniors having trouble with the transition to the 2kg implement, general strength is probably getting more and more important.

  • For Coach Pendleton, the MuscleLab was developed in Norway by a company called Ergotest and I think the website is Home - MUSCLELAB – Ergotest Innovation or perhaps .no
    the MicroMuscleLab was a handheld version of the big system which could measure all kinds of sensors including force plates, electrogoiniometers and emg activity, but we only used about 5% of its capabilities so I worked with the developer to come up with the handheld unit that worked with a linear encoder attached to the bar to measure the speed and distance of the bar movement! and therefore the acceleration and power output. The biggest advantage of this unit was that it was very portable as it fitted into a small camera bag. The power+ system could also be linked to a contact mat or infra red sensor to measure jumps and reaction time so was very useful.
    the test that we developed which Rutger spoke about was a simple test of 5reps with a certain weight, typically 100kg, that allowed us to compare athletes. The 1632watts that he spoke about was an average power output over these 5 reps and was pretty accurate to compare as the training year developed. Justin Rhode spoke earlier about a similar system, the Tendo Analyser, which measures peak power but we found not to be too accurate when compared to the MucleLab.
    the MuscleLab also allowed us to predict the optimum load, and also the theoretical max load which was a useful predictor of 1RM without any potential risks for injury and to see progression. The full machine also allowed us to plot the force/power curves of athletes under a range of loads so we could see the curve move to the right under more effective training, and also how power was seen at specific loads such as the weight of the shot. We could compare athletes this way which was very interesting.
    i am not sure if they still produce the microMucleLab, but they made a version where the linear encoder plugged directly into a laptop via USB and the software gave the information which was very practical. They have been developing a new MuscleLab which is now released but is all singing and dancing but probably much more than anyone other than a performance lab would need, and it is very expensive.
    what I found from working with the MuscleLab over a number of years was that you can apply the principles that it teaches you without the need for the technology. In general a useful rule of thumb is the highest load you can move 5 reps in 6 seconds is a pretty good indicator of power, and this holds true for bench and squats. Olympic lifts you are pretty much performing at hight power any way if you are performing them right. I did change more towards hang snatch as my main source of power as this generated highest relative outputs, and then hang cleans.
    The other over-riding principle that came out of this is to always have the intent to move the bar as fast as possible in all lifts and all sets. This way you will develop fast twitch fibres at all stages of the programme. This has been applied with great effect by Vesteinn Hafsteinsson and his athletes over the past 6-8 years, and you can see the examples of this in the lifting films on the Home | Global Throwing website. Kim Christensen performing 215kg x6 reps fast in Bench is very impressive. Vesteinn does not use the machine, only the principles that he has got from my use of the machine, and this has been the biggest change in his training methods in recent years.
    I hope this helps with this discussion. It is not about how much you Bench but in how you do it as Speed is King here always. If you want to throw 20m you have to have a release speed approaching 13m/s so this is the most important factor. It is much more important to have people move reasonable loads fast (peak of power curve for Bench Press is around 50% 1RM) than just a big slow maximum bench. As Dr Bondarchuk notes in his book, the correlation between 1RM Bench Press and max distance thrown in Shot Putt is 0.39 so you should not spend a great deal of time worrying about it. Once you have reasonable strength levels you can throw far.
    ShaunP

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